Acquisition of additional licenses

[quote] Miroshnichenko Maxim Aleksandrovich CEO OneBox wrote: Next version of OneBox will be cloud ONLY [/quote] That is, did I understand you correctly that once we bought a "box" from you, we acted recklessly because after a while you will still force us to switch to a subscription?

[quote] That is, did I understand you correctly that once we bought a "box" from you, we acted recklessly because after a while you will still force us to switch to a subscription? [/quote] In fact, yes, right now it already looks like this. Six months ago, I didn’t plan to abandon the boxes at all, but I had to do something: how to develop the product if customers don’t pay for the new version? Why should they get it for free? At first I planned to make an "upgrade costs money" and copy the microsoft windows model, but in this case, upgrading to the next version would cost about 50-70%. Also, the current OneBox work model in relation to improvements is not fair for customers: someone orders a revision and pays for it, and everyone gets it. Now I am in the process of developing a model in which we will offer users a "cloud", but they will be able to order improvements and influence the development of the system absolutely free. In any case, we do not take the current box that users have bought. You can use it as long as you want. So it is written in the contract and I can’t do anything about it (and I don’t want to). But, I will say straight away, the next OneBox product will only be billed "monthly" and free improvements (according to some regulations). We will not force anyone to switch to it.

That is, boxed Boxing, even for a fee, will not be able to upgrade to the next version of the new version?

[quote] Lysenko Alexander wrote: force us to switch to a subscription? [/quote] It looks like it will be voluntarily forced without options))

[quote] That is, boxed Boxing, even for a fee, will not be able to upgrade to the next version of the new version? [/quote] Yes, it won't work. The next version will only be billed as "/month" or "/year".

There is another question related to this. If I now have one perpetual license, and I buy another pack of 5 licenses. And I will buy one license for rent. In that case, will we have updates?

[quote] Michael Client wrote: In this regard, there is another question. If I now have one eternal license, and I will buy another package of 5 licenses. And I will buy one license for rent. In that case, will we have updates? [/quote] I didn't understand at first, but then I got it. no options with boxed version next

[quote] Miroshnichenko Maxim Aleksandrovich CEO OneBox wrote: That is, did I understand you correctly that having once bought a "box" from you, we acted recklessly because after a while you will still force us to switch to a subscription? In fact, yes, right now it already looks like that. Six months ago I I didn’t plan to abandon the boxes at all, but I had to do something: how to develop the product if customers don’t pay for the new version? Why should they get it for free? At first, I planned to make an "upgrade costs money" and copy the microsoft windows model, but in this case, the upgrade to the next version would cost about 50-70%. Also, the current OneBox work model in relation to improvements is not fair for clients: someone orders revision and pays for it, and everyone gets it. Now I am in the process of developing a model in which we will offer users a "cloud", but they will be able to order revisions and influence the development of the system absolutely free. In any case , the current box that users have bought - we do not collect. You can use it as long as you want. It’s written in the contract and I can’t do anything about it (and I don’t want to). But, I’ll say it right away, the next OneBox product will only be billed “monthly” and free improvements (according to some regulations). We will not force anyone to switch to it. [/quote] This is not fair of you. I purchased perpetual licenses from you under the conditions that were earlier. At the moment there are no old conditions, but there are new conditions. I am ready to purchase licenses on new terms and pay for them at existing rates. But I can't do it. must transfer the old conditions to the new tariff. When you didn’t have technical support on the site, we didn’t whine that we make improvements for our money and everyone uses them (now, in theory, improvements are free and you don’t like that we will use them for free). Yes, at the moment you do not have boxed licenses, it is your right to set the conditions. I agree that my boxed version will not be upgraded unless I purchase additional terms. But why can't I purchase a new tariff? In my opinion, this is fair: I buy the "cloud 3" tariff and my 14 licenses can also be used in the "cloud 3" tariff. At the same time, you, as a developer, have the opportunity to prescribe such conditions in the tariffs as you wish. I am more than sure that "cloud 3" is not enough for me and I need a larger tariff. In this case, you unilaterally limit our partnership obligations.

I'm afraid to guess what awaits me when I want to buy more licenses in a year ...

[quote] Bogomaz Dmitry Vladimirovich The client wrote: Miroshnichenko Maxim Alexandrovich CEO of OneBox wrote: So, I understood you correctly that once we bought a "box" from you, we acted recklessly because after a while you will still force us to switch to a subscription? In fact, yes, right now it already looks like this. Six months ago, I didn’t plan to abandon the boxes at all, but I had to do something: how to develop the product if customers don’t pay for the new version? Why should they get it for free? At first, I planned to make an "upgrade costs money" and copy the microsoft windows model, but in this case, the upgrade to the next version would cost about 50-70%. Also, the current OneBox work model in relation to improvements is not fair for clients: someone orders revision and pays for it, and everyone gets it. Now I am in the process of developing a model in which we will offer users a "cloud", but they will be able to order revisions and influence the development of the system absolutely free. In any case , the current box that users have bought - we do not collect. You can use it as long as you want. It’s written in the contract and I can’t do anything about it (and I don’t want to). But, I’ll say it right away, the next OneBox product will only be billed “monthly” and free improvements (according to some regulations). We will not force anyone to switch to it. This is not fair of you. I purchased perpetual licenses from you under the conditions that were earlier. At the moment there are no old conditions, but there are new conditions. I am ready to purchase licenses on new terms and pay for them at existing rates. But I can't do it. must transfer the old conditions to the new tariff. When you didn’t have technical support on the site, we didn’t whine that we make improvements for our money and everyone uses them (now, in theory, improvements are free and you don’t like that we will use them for free). Yes, at the moment you don’t have boxed licenses it is your right to set the terms. I agree that my boxed version will not be upgraded unless I purchase additional terms. But why can't I purchase a new tariff? In my opinion, this is fair: I buy the "cloud 3" tariff and my 14 licenses can also be used in the "cloud 3" tariff. At the same time, you, as a developer, have the opportunity to prescribe such conditions in the tariffs as you wish. I am more than sure that "cloud 3" is not enough for me and I need a higher tariff. In this case, you unilaterally limit our partnership obligations. [/quote] Completely agree with this solution. And it turns out that the boxed versions are a hit and miss.

[quote] Bogomaz Dmitry Vladimirovich Client wrote: This is not fair of you. I purchased perpetual licenses from you under the conditions that were earlier. At the moment there are no old conditions, but there are new conditions. I am ready to purchase licenses on new terms and pay for them at existing rates. But I can't do it. must transfer the old conditions to the new tariff. When you didn’t have technical support on the site, we didn’t whine that we make improvements for our money and everyone uses them (now, in theory, improvements are free and you don’t like that we will use them for free). Yes, at the moment you do not have boxed licenses, it is your right to set the conditions. I agree that my boxed version will not be upgraded unless I purchase additional terms. But why can't I purchase a new tariff? In my opinion, this is fair: I buy the "cloud 3" tariff and my 14 licenses can also be used in the "cloud 3" tariff. At the same time, you, as a developer, have the opportunity to prescribe such conditions in the tariffs as you wish. I am more than sure that "cloud 3" is not enough for me and I need a larger tariff. In this case, you unilaterally limit our partnership obligations. [/quote] Max, I'm not going to talk about honestly / not honestly. But, let's take a look at the steps that you get now. 1. The new sales model breaks the relationship with the owners of the boxes sold. 2. This causes resentment and dissatisfaction of VERY LOYAL users. 3. Those who believe in OneBox and therefore actively use it ALREADY feel cheated. To recommend something and even more so to advise is very stupid. But I think that we can consider a model according to which: - existing users buy a minimal cloud solution; - continue to use their box with the possibility of updates under their licenses; - if they need more jobs than the box + cloud minimum wage, they move to a larger package. This solves two problems at once: - OneBox develops in a new direction; - loyal users stay with their own. Ladies and gentlemen, how is this option?

[quote] At the same time, you, as a developer, have the opportunity to prescribe such conditions in the tariffs as you wish. I am more than sure that "cloud 3" is not enough for me and I need a larger tariff. In this case, you unilaterally limit our partnership obligations. [/quote] Because the next version of OneBox will be ONLY cloud-based, this is not a matter of want / do not want, it is a matter of technology: part of the code is always in the cloud and is never installed on the client's server. And because it is impossible to update part of the licenses, and leave some without updating. Yes, we have plans to make more flexible dynamic cloud rates, but it's still a cloud, and it's still billing / month or / year. It's not fair, it's when a customer buys a product, pays for it once, and then demands that there be free support and consultations forever, updates are free, and this is all for life. Yes, in the past we have been so stupid to offer such conditions ourselves, but this does not oblige us to continue them with new purchases of customers.

[quote] But, let's take a look at the steps that you get now. 1. The new sales model breaks the relationship with the owners of the boxes sold. 2. This causes resentment and dissatisfaction of VERY LOYAL users. 3. Those who believe in OneBox and therefore actively use it ALREADY feel cheated. [/quote] I will say frankly and publicly: I am not Dima Levoshich and I don’t care if someone is satisfied with my actions or not. I evaluate the success of any action by ONLY one criterion: they get paid for it. Now, I will never provide anyone with any service or give any product for free, just so that he will have a good opinion of me. I do not need it. For me it is not valuable. I am not afraid of reviews, indignation, threats and courts. If the client does not want a new version of the product - I do not force him. If he wants to, he will buy it on my terms. I will not waste my time (first of all) and the resources of the team (secondarily) to bargain with someone and prove something to him. I am no longer interested in boxes because they do not allow the company to grow and make a new product better and better. Because ordering improvements is not an honest scheme. Right now OneBox is in such a position that even if 80% of the boxed customers leave / stop using boxing, it will be easier for me. Because the cloud is already making more money. "Remember this tweet" :)

[quote] Completely agree with this solution. And it turns out that the boxed versions are a hit and miss. [/quote] With the same logic, "buying the 95th windows'a is also a hit."

[quote] Miroshnichenko Maxim Aleksandrovich CEO OneBox wrote: Completely agree with this solution. And it turns out that boxed versions are a hit. With the same logic, "buying windows 95 is also a hit." [/quote] Not certainly in that way. I am ready to buy a cloud plan, but you do not sell it to me, because I have already bought a product from you.

[quote] Not certainly in that way. I am ready to buy a cloud plan, but you do not sell it to me, because I have already bought a product from you. [/quote] You can buy a cloud product, but it will be a separate onebox. We can't put together an old box + a new cloud. Therefore, we offer a transition to the cloud - 6 months of any cloud tariff is free for everyone who switches from any box to the cloud.

[quote] Legeza Vyacheslav Valerianovich Employee wrote: Bogomaz Dmitry Vladimirovich The client wrote: This is not fair on your part. I purchased perpetual licenses from you under the conditions that were earlier. At the moment there are no old conditions, but there are new conditions. I am ready to purchase licenses on new terms and pay for them at existing rates. But I can't do it. should transfer the old conditions to the new tariff. When you didn’t have technical support on the site, we didn’t whine that we make improvements for our money and everyone uses them (now, in theory, improvements are free and you don’t like that we will use them for free). Yes at the moment you do not have boxed licenses it is your right to set the terms. I agree that my boxed version will not be upgraded unless I purchase additional terms. But why can't I purchase a new tariff? In my opinion, this is fair: I buy the "cloud 3" tariff and my 14 licenses can also be used in the "cloud 3" tariff. At the same time, you, as a developer, have the opportunity to prescribe such conditions in the tariffs as you wish. I am more than sure that "cloud 3" is not enough for me and I need a larger tariff. In this case, you unilaterally limit our partnership obligations. Max, I will not talk about honestly / not honestly. But, let's take it step by step, what do you get now.1. The new sales model breaks the relationship with the owners of the boxes sold.2. This causes resentment and dissatisfaction of VERY LOYAL users.3. Those who believe in OneBox and therefore actively use it ALREADY feel cheated. It is very stupid to recommend something, let alone advise. But I think that we can consider a model according to which: - existing users buy a minimal cloud solution; - further use their box with the possibility of updates under their licenses; - if they need more jobs than the box + cloud minimum wage, they switch to a larger package. This solves two problems at once: - OneBox develops in a new direction; - loyal users remain with their own. Ladies and gentlemen, how is this option? [/quote] I support it as an option!

What I see from the dialogue with Max: 1. PURPOSE: to develop OneBox and make it much better. 2. To make this goal achievable, the sales model is changing. 3. New model is: - monthly payments for use, CRM leasing. - free updates for all OneBox users; - free and qualitatively new technical support; - the ability to communicate through the forum with developers and colleagues; - free hosting in the cloud with access by the number of licenses. 4. What can not be done: - mold a box and a cloud, as these are different products; - leave everything as it is for existing users; 5. What can be done right now: - stay on the boxed version further, without updates; - buy a minimum cloud package in order to expand through it; - set up synchronization so that some employees work, as before in the box, and bring some to the cloud OneBox. It seems like this is an option for those who want develop together with OneBox to don't feel offended.

[quote] Miroshnichenko Maxim Alexandrovich OneBox CEO wrote: [quote] But, let's take a look at the steps that you get now. 1. The new sales model breaks the relationship with the owners of the boxes sold. 2. This causes resentment and dissatisfaction of VERY LOYAL users. 3. Those who believe in OneBox and therefore actively use it ALREADY feel cheated. [/quote] I will say frankly and publicly: I am not Dima Levoshich and I don’t care if someone is satisfied with my actions or not. I evaluate the success of any action by ONLY one criterion: they get paid for it. Now, I will never provide anyone with any service or give any product for free, just so that he will have a good opinion of me. I do not need it. For me it is not valuable. I am not afraid of reviews, indignation, threats and courts. If the client does not want a new version of the product - I do not force him. If he wants to, he will buy it on my terms. I will not waste my time (first of all) and the resources of the team (secondarily) to bargain with someone and prove something to him. I am no longer interested in boxes because they do not allow the company to grow and make a new product better and better. Because ordering improvements is not an honest scheme. Right now OneBox is in such a position that even if 80% of the boxed customers leave / stop using boxing, it will be easier for me. Because the cloud is already making more money. "Remember this tweet" :) [/quote] There are no words. To opt for "Openly send everyone to dick", given that they themselves screwed up with the initial model, instead of treating old customers loyally ... If you do not care about those who are now on the box and will be happy that they will fall off, then why not make more acceptable conditions for the price of the Cloud in combination? Or not to arrange a bondage with a mandatory update if you choose a combo?!

[quote] Farkhshatov Rodion Client wrote: Or not to arrange a bondage with a mandatory update if you choose a combo?! [/quote] Amendment: with a paid upgrade, despite the contract

[quote] There are no words. To opt for "Openly send everyone to dick", given that they themselves screwed up with the initial model, instead of treating old customers loyally ... [/quote] Yes, I screwed up with the model. So what? I don't have to support her anymore. Not a single signed contract regulates that the client at any time has the opportunity to buy something in addition. My choice is simple: either close OneBox and make other software under a different brand, or say it like it is. I chose the second option. [quote] If you do not care about those who are now on the box and will be happy that they will fall off, then why not make more acceptable conditions for the price of the Cloud in combination? Or not to arrange a bondage with a mandatory update if you choose a combo?! [/quote] From my point of view, we just made quite acceptable conditions in combination. We ask ~12% per year for keeping the boxes up to date. And we allow customers to buy more users as needed.

[quote] Miroshnichenko Maxim Alexandrovich OneBox CEO wrote: We ask ~12% per year for keeping the boxes up to date. And we allow customers to buy more users as needed. [/quote] I think this is acceptable, although it's frustrating that I won't see a new version.

[quote] Miroshnichenko Maxim Alexandrovich OneBox CEO wrote: We ask ~12% per year for keeping the boxes up to date. And we allow customers to buy more users as needed [/quote] Fits